guild relations- networking

[ms_ashling]

wow boards are down, and this issue is buggn me

How do you guys network? I apprently offended a guild, and have been banned from their website, and now get ingame hate, just from saying Hi, check us out, I like your values, maybe we can work together, see you around. I've /ignored in game now, but that's not like me. It's not really worth the energy to me. You can't change who people are, but I don't want to make the "same" mistake again.

[Rollie]

Typically just by chatting with people I group with. I have not done any proactive 'cold call' style contacts, but I have never really had need to either.

[oiseaux]

Most of the friends I make are in bad groups when 2-3 other ppl in the group are complaining via whispers about the tank/healer or whoever. If the healer was good then I ALWAYS whisper them to let them know. Usually they are thankful that anyone noticed because healers only get yelled at for not healing enough. I put them on my friends list and we chat everyone once and a while about whatnot. Are we best friends? no but I guess it would be some type of network. They whisper me if they need a warlock and if I need a priest or tank then I would ask them.

Going to a guild's site you should be prepared to get ridiculed because you are now on their territory so to speak.

I also made some friends while pvping during my lowbie levels. I feel like we "grew up" together or something haha

[ms_ashling]

yup.. I guess I learned the hard way. Maybe it's considered threatening..? I was accused of having malicious intent. Though, I do want to meet more of the greymane folk that are forum trolls, and learn about their guilds, as #1 I enjoy meeting them, #2 I do want to find guilds with similar values and ethics, as we are very very small, and we need like guilds in order to pool our resources. The last thing I want to do is steal their members, or tell them how to run their guild.. -although there is a little gnome I have my eyes on in my old guild o.O I think forum communication and event planning is key, and a lot of guilds struggle with this..

[Alanthus]

Due to the focus of the game on specifically geared and specced 40 man raids with limited flexibility on classes guilds in WoW tend to be more exclusive than has been the case in earlier MMO's, most MMO's (and other communities) show a trend towards more exclusive behaviour as time passes so the fact that this has been a strong trend from the first guilds doing MC will probably make it even worse in the future.

That said the entire guild politics and drama thing is IMO one of the major triggers for people quitting specific MMO's or even more so for quitting MMO's in general, I hope you find some people with a more laid back attitude to hang around with

As for networking the sheer size of the WoW community is a problem and the fact that the boards are down when the game is down really puts a damper on the usual networking paths, the fact that the game is designed to be more active than many previous MMO's definately has a negative impact on community/networking as well (crafting or farming while posting on boards or chatting is more prevalent in a game with more automatic fighting etc.) I think that I chatted more in one month playing DAOC than the entire time I have played WoW.

[ms_ashling]

True. I am still hopeful though, but when hopes get high, they have a lot farther to crash, when it all comes down. I guess Blizz succeeded in developing a very interactive game w/ many things to do to keep yourself occupied. I wonder if in the future, the Realms would come with descriptions (Like boards or chat rooms) i.e 20-30 somethings, or professionals, or looking for a good time, etc. It's highly doubtful, but it may help with community and guild relation issues, if everyone in the realm had something in common, or was there for the realm, and not just because they liked the realm name, or biz assigned them to that realm. Guild politics though, will always be around, as is a big discourager at times. I assume that comes 'standard' though with all communities in any activity. ... /shrug /sigh

[oiseaux]

I would love to see blizzard have realms with age limits or other areas of interest, but I doubt that will happen. What it would turn into is a dating site and we know what type of individuals those sites attract. Blizzard cannot even figure out how to balance horde vs. alliance let alone a realm with ppl's interest at hand. It is almost 2 years and Tuesday's maintenance isn't even figured out yet. Yeah so that won't be happening. We can only dream

[Hawk]

I have found networking with other guilds somewhat of a task in the WoW game.

I have ran 2 other very large guilds in Asharons Call and we had guild embassordors to work with other guilds.

This is a different game with a different guilding set up that in my humble opion, is not condusive to this type of relationships in general.

Starshadow is looking forward to several other new games that we already have guild beta invites, one of which we are extreamly excited about, and that is Vanguard. Seems to be a very guild friendly set up.

[ms_ashling]

What makes games guild friendly or not friendly? Is it the options available for "communication/trading/events, etc.?"

[Sianni]

Dark Age of Camelot had the best system I've ever seen in a game for guild relations, with the alliance system. In other games, guild alliances have to be set up outside of the game's interface, which means you have to rely on message boards and the like - something that is always a challenge, because not everyone will go to the boards. In WoW, you can make a chat channel for your guild alliance, and hope people use it. In DAOC, aligned guilds pretty much had automatic access to an alliance channel, which removed the step of nagging people to join it.

I saw many successful guild alliances in DAOC, I've yet to see one that lasts more than a few months in WoW though. In EQ, we had a quasi-successful alliance on my server, but even it required a lot of maintenance. IMHO, the easier a game interface makes it on people to participate in an alliance, the more chance the alliance has of succeeding.

[Alanthus]

Comparing WoW to DAOC is a li'l unfair, in DAOC the enemy was the other two realms and for that reason alone alliances was a natural way of doing things, in addition you didn't have to farm high end content with 40 ppl geared specifically for it for months to get competitive gear which allowed a much more casual (by comparison) approach to loot. In WoW the enemy in PvP is other guilds or players in your own realm...

A structured PvP game will always have better working guild relations than a gear oriented PvE game simply because people are more inclined to cooperate with players on their own team.

The mechanics can help too but I don't think they are the most important thing.

[Sianni]

You may be right Alanthas. I detest free-for-all PvP, so I can't really speak to those kinds of games.

[Alanthus]

FFA PvP and structured PvP are two different animals, structured PvP is when you can't attack just any other player but only those that are your enemy - this can be realm, faction, alliance or whatever but essentially means you fight enemies according to some larger back story. Often this also means dedicated PvP areas and PvE areas beyond a single safe zone to start in. FFA PvP where you can attack and kill anyone is IMO most of the time not a good environment for guild alliances but any guilds and alliances that manage to stay together in that environment will probably be very rewarding communities to be gaming with

[Sianni]

but any guilds and alliances that manage to stay together in that environment will probably be very rewarding communities to be gaming with

truer words, and all that =)

Interestingly enough though, back in DAOC, the real benefits to a guild alliance came in dungeon crawls and master level raids (ie PvE content)... for RvR, that was mostly single guild driven. Could have just been my server, but that was my experience. In EQ, alliance benefits were for PvE gains as well.

But you are right, alliances for gear-driven reason are doomed, IMHO. Loot whoring and greed tend to kill even single guilds, not just alliance relations. Alliances for a PvP goal will, by their nature, tend to spawn more cooperation, because the greed factor is (mostly) negated.

[Alanthus]

Oh, guilds and alliances definately are most beneficial for PvE content... or rather for content that support the final goal(s) in a game but aren't necessarily goals in themselves, being prepared is half the battle . Gear driven guilds and alliances fall apart very easily which I guess is the reason why most WoW guilds I know of have either fallen apart or most of the membership has changed, a very different story than what happened in DAOC and a much faster decay.

[xpolockx]

Yeah, most guild alliances and guilds themselves fall apart because the point is not so much working together to progress as it is every member trying to get as much loot as possible. The guilds and guild alliances that stay together the longest are usually filled with the most unselfish people as well - the ones willing to work together even if it means that they won't be the first one in the guild to have all the best gear.

[oiseaux]

I agree 100% with Xpolockx. Most guilds fall apart because of loot. Guilds start off as a "casual", friendly group and then they decide to begin raiding. Suddenly you have your A-team raiders and everyone else is left behind causing attendence problems and jealousy/greed issues. It is okay to want to further your character, but usually it gets to the point where you have officers and class leaders paid off to prohibit you from rolling or spending DKP. As crazy as this sounds, I found myself in this situation with my warrior. Unfortunately, it doesn't help that the mechanics behind pve and pvp force you to have the best gear or you are just not even on the same playing field.

That is why guild alliances never work in this game. Too much is centralized around getting better gear for your toon.

[Tashana]

We attempted to maintain good relations with other guilds under the guidance of our previous GM. This seemed to work for a while and we even merged one of the guilds into our own. Lately though, most guilds seem content with a policy of isolationism and don't openly work with other guilds. I guess my question (as the current GM) is: Is the idea of guilds working together a thing of the past or should I keep my hope up?
________
BMW R80

[Alanthus]

The only chance for guilds to begin working together in WoW is if the world PvP revamp is successful and makes it worthwhile to actually cooperate. I'm not really expecting this, the cross server BG's will just make gear gathering all the more important and I have a feeling that a lot of servers will just get mega guilds if world PvP starts working, can't wait 'til 1000+ characters is considered the norm for a WoW guild :/

[xpolockx]

can't wait 'til 1000+ characters is considered the norm for a WoW guild

Now that would be crazy, especially considering the guild viewer is broken at 500 chars (my guild has about 800 chars and 550 accounts we guess), so they'd have to do a little fixing first Guess we'll see how the new "world pvp" objectives work into guild relations.